| ible |
| Received |
From |
Subject |
| 5/11/25 4:31 pm |
lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...> |
Re: [IBLE] Quick Update |
| 5/11/25 4:07 pm |
lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...> |
[IBLE] Quick Update |
| 5/11/25 7:14 am |
lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...> |
Re: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
| 5/11/25 6:29 am |
Jim via groups.io <jjameshouse...> |
Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID (reviving thread from last week) |
| 5/10/25 9:33 pm |
Jay Carlisle via groups.io <carlislejay...> |
Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID (reviving thread from last week) |
| 5/10/25 2:28 pm |
Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> |
Re: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
| 5/10/25 1:27 pm |
Bill Moore via groups.io <hootowlbill...> |
Re: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
| 5/10/25 1:12 pm |
Patty GAILEY via groups.io <triadcorgis...> |
Re: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
| 5/9/25 5:49 pm |
lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...> |
[IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
| 5/6/25 8:12 pm |
Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> |
[IBLE] Island Park Reservoir |
| 5/4/25 12:50 pm |
lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...> |
Re: [IBLE] Finally |
| 5/3/25 6:04 pm |
Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...> |
Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
| 5/3/25 4:37 pm |
scott urban via groups.io <scotturban610...> |
Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
| 5/3/25 1:44 pm |
Ken Miracle via groups.io <chukar28...> |
Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
| 5/3/25 12:28 pm |
Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> |
Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
| 5/3/25 12:20 pm |
Ken Miracle via groups.io <chukar28...> |
Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
| 5/3/25 12:07 pm |
Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> |
[IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
| 5/3/25 11:14 am |
Bill Moore via groups.io <hootowlbill...> |
[IBLE] Finally |
| 5/3/25 8:41 am |
Cheryl Huizinga via groups.io <bchuizinga...> |
[IBLE] Black-bellied Plover at Ft Boise WMA near Parma in Canyon Co. |
| 5/2/25 5:15 am |
Richard and Ann Rusnak via groups.io <rarusnak62...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 7:34 pm |
Jay Carlisle via groups.io <carlislejay...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 7:14 pm |
Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 6:58 pm |
Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 6:35 pm |
Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 6:29 pm |
Jim via groups.io <jjameshouse...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 3:27 pm |
Carter Strope via groups.io <cmstropep...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 2:41 pm |
rattlesnake4873 via groups.io <Rattlesnake4873...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 2:37 pm |
Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 10:57 am |
Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 10:48 am |
akswanson via groups.io <swansonalc...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 5/1/25 10:06 am |
henderson.danette via groups.io <danette444...> |
[IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
| 4/30/25 9:40 pm |
Kent Kleman via groups.io <Kentkleman...> |
Re: [IBLE] American Golden-Plover at Blacks Creek Reservoir |
| 4/24/25 10:08 am |
henderson.danette via groups.io <danette444...> |
[IBLE] Continuing Harlequin Duck Hwy 21 |
| 4/23/25 8:57 am |
Jordan Ragsdale via groups.io <salmanazar...> |
Re: [IBLE] Male Harlequin Duck, hwy 21 b/t Boise & Idaho City |
| 4/22/25 7:17 pm |
Jay Carlisle via groups.io <carlislejay...> |
[IBLE] Male Harlequin Duck, hwy 21 b/t Boise & Idaho City |
| 4/13/25 12:27 pm |
lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...> |
[IBLE] Some More Spring Arrivals |
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Date: 5/11/25 4:07 pm
From: lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...>
Subject: [IBLE] Quick Update |
Both Yellow & Yellow Yellow-rumped Warblers arrived en masse today. And, walked out on deck after most recent round of thunderstorms pushed thru & was met face-to-face by a male Black-chinned Hummingbird buzzing me to fill & out out the nectar feeder, lol! Did so & he was hitting it 5 minutes later!
Brian Carrigan
Blackfoot
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Date: 5/11/25 7:14 am
From: lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
Wow, Patty! That's an impressive group of spring migrants. The bunting, oriole, warbler & grosbeaks haven't found my feeders yet. But, good to know they're in the area.
This AM, a group of Cedar Waxwings that have nested in a widrow of Rocky Mtn Junipers, I planted yrs ago, have been scoping out the trees. Funny how birds can get on the "wrong side" of another. A robin kept chasing only one particular waxwing through the trees! Lasted about 5 minutes. Don't know what that waxwing did to upset the robin, but it was entertaining to watch.
Brian Carrigan
Blackfoot
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Date: 5/10/25 9:33 pm
From: Jay Carlisle via groups.io <carlislejay...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID (reviving thread from last week) |
Very late to the party but I'll just quickly say that most of the reason we went out to Blacks Creek too look for the potential Pacific Golden - present 9-10 days ago - is because people like Cliff (IBLE) & Carter (on Facebook, has been seeing lots of Pacific in Hawaii) helped suggest this bird could be a Pacific in the first place! Thus, I was already pretty convinced it was Pacific, and some of the photos from earlier in the day on May 1 show the fieldmarks really well (i.e., ebird.org/checklist/S231624819 & ebird.org/checklist/S231731944 but others too), so hearing the call was the icing on the cake for me.
Fun to see pics of 2Â American Golden-plovers from eastern Idaho today https://ebird.org/checklist/S236005390Â - notice how much more elongated (longer wings)Â they look than the Pacific.
Thanks Cliff for sharing the detail behind this challenging ID!
Jay
On Saturday, May 3, 2025 at 07:04:44 PM MDT, Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...> wrote:
Jay Carlisle confirmed the bird as a Pacific based on the call.
Louisa Evers
<elouisa603...> care of the birds and you take care of the world
On Sat, May 3, 2025 at 13:06 Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> wrote:
I've looked at more than 20 eBird checklists for the Pacific Golden Plover at Black's Creek. I don't see much mention of the relative length of Primaries/Tertails/Tail that is the only reliable way to separate American and Pacific without calls. It works in any plumage with the only caveat being that it may not work for molting birds.Â
Breeding plumage Americans with no white on the flanks are straight forward but during molt they can look like much like Pacifics, and juveniles are very similar. The long bill and long legs can be helpful but a good look at the Primary/Tertial/Tail relationship can make it easy. Here are the important points taken from this article "Morphometric features of Pacific and American Golden-Plovers with comments on field identification"(https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=9bc92b3f984f118928e8f292158d19a586cc53ea):
- Pacific has 2-3 primaries visible beyond tertials, American has 4-5
- tertials extend to distal third of tail, ending at or near tail tip in most Pacific, from half to distal third of tail on American
- wing tip extends past end of tail more on American than Pacific, with little or no overlap
- tips of outer two primaries are closer together on Pacific, with some overlap.
With a good look at the rear end of the bird these differences create a different overall look, even if you can't see the details clearly. Kent's original photo that was posted to IBLE is a good example - it hints at Pacific with tertials appearing to extend nearly to end of tail and very short primary tips visible. You can't quite see the details but there is enough to suggest the need for a closer look. After reviewing the above linked article I did a Google search for photos and these features are clearly visible in countless examples of both species. If you want to get a better handle on Golden Plovers I'd recommend reading the article and spending some time looking at photos.
Cliff
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 5/10/25 2:28 pm
From: Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
Island Park is a little behind but I've been hearing Cassin's Finches,
Ruby-crowned Kinglets and Yellow-rumped Warblers for the past few days.
The finches have probably been here for a while but I only started
hearing them recently. Tree Swallows have also arrived and are claiming
nest cavities. It's hot up here and feels like summer but we still have
more arrivals to come.
Cliff
On 5/10/25 02:26PM, Bill Moore via groups.io wrote:
> We’ve got more migrants showing up. Calliope and Broad Tailed hummers
> arrived, joining the BC. Numbers are increasing and they’re working
> feeder now, not just a high speed fly by. BG swallows showed yesterday
> and I just saw a Lazuli. GB Heron down in stream. Kestrel working the
> back, now if they’d just use house I put up.
>
> Bill Moore
> Hoot Owl
> Inkom
>
>> On May 9, 2025, at 6:49 PM, lcarrigan_55 via groups.io
>> <carriganbw...> wrote:
>>
>> 
>> There's been a Spring push of birds through our place today. Cassin's
>> Finches, Chipping Sparrows, Pine Siskins & White-crowned Sparrows
>> have all come through. At least one Black-headed Grosbeak has
>> arrived, as well as, a couple of Red-naped Sapsuckers. No
>> Black-chinned Hummingbirds, as of yet.
>> I have 2 Wild Turkey hens coming in which feed on scattered sunflower
>> seeds from the platform feeder. And, as soon as they show, a few hen
>> Ring-necked Pheasants appear, too. Both Tree & Violet-green Swallows
>> are overhead.
>> Brian Carrigan
>> Blackfoot
>
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 5/10/25 1:27 pm
From: Bill Moore via groups.io <hootowlbill...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
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Date: 5/10/25 1:12 pm
From: Patty GAILEY via groups.io <triadcorgis...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
Thanks, Brian...fun to hear about the Snake River side of Blackfoot. We've also had new arrivals south of Blackfoot by the Blackfoot River. YH Blackbirds 12-15 at a time come to the platform feeder every morning. Other newbies include Pine Siskin, Cassin's Finch, White-crowned Sparrow, Lazuli Bunting, Bullock's Oriole, Evening Grosbeak, Black-headed Grosbeak, Yellow Rumped Warbler, House Wren, Killdeer. Evening Grosbeaks stayed all summer last year for the first time. We'll see what this year brings. Eight California Quail come to clean up under the feeders every evening. Hummer feeders are out but no takers yet.
Patty Gailey
South of Blackfoot
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Date: 5/9/25 5:49 pm
From: lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...>
Subject: [IBLE] A Spring Migration Push |
There's been a Spring push of birds through our place today. Cassin's Finches, Chipping Sparrows, Pine Siskins & White-crowned Sparrows have all come through. At least one Black-headed Grosbeak has arrived, as well as, a couple of Red-naped Sapsuckers. No Black-chinned Hummingbirds, as of yet.
I have 2 Wild Turkey hens coming in which feed on scattered sunflower seeds from the platform feeder. And, as soon as they show, a few hen Ring-necked Pheasants appear, too. Both Tree & Violet-green Swallows are overhead.
Brian Carrigan
Blackfoot
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Date: 5/6/25 8:12 pm
From: Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...>
Subject: [IBLE] Island Park Reservoir |
We hiked out to the west end of Island Park Res. today for some
shorebirding. There wasn't much out there but we did have a group of
five Sanderlings, I think the most I've seen up here at one time. There
was also a group of Long-billed Dowitchers but we couldn't make any of
them into Short-billeds, try as we might. A Wilson's Snipe, a pair of
Long-billed Curlews and a few Willets were the only other shorebirds we
saw. Three days ago we had a good sized flock of American Avocets, five
Black-necked Stilts (not terribly common up here), and a few Killdeer.
On our way home we had three Lesser Yellowlegs and fifteen or so
Wilson's Phalaropes on a snow melt pond out in the sagebrush. The next
couple weeks will be prime time for shorebirds here so I'll try to get
out there a few more times.
Cliff
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 5/4/25 12:50 pm
From: lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] Finally |
Thanks for the report! Have RW Blackbirds, Mourning Doves & Cassin's Finches are pushing through. Swainson's Hawks are arriving, first arrived mid-April on neighbor's farm, & Ospreys have staked out their pole nests. Hearing GH Owls & W Screech, no Saw-whet as of yet. Although, Boreal Chorus frogs are calling at night along Spring channel in back. But, no BC Hummingbirds & no BH Grosbeaks, as of yet...definitely late, compared to last yr. Keep watching daily for them.
Brian Carrigan
Blackfoot
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Date: 5/3/25 6:04 pm
From: Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
Jay Carlisle confirmed the bird as a Pacific based on the call.
Louisa Evers
<elouisa603...>
Take care of the birds and you take care of the world
On Sat, May 3, 2025 at 13:06 Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa=
<octobersetters.com...> wrote:
> I've looked at more than 20 eBird checklists for the Pacific Golden Plover
> at Black's Creek. I don't see much mention of the relative length of
> Primaries/Tertails/Tail that is the only reliable way to separate American
> and Pacific without calls. It works in any plumage with the only caveat
> being that it may not work for molting birds.
>
> Breeding plumage Americans with no white on the flanks are straight
> forward but during molt they can look like much like Pacifics, and
> juveniles are very similar. The long bill and long legs can be helpful but
> a good look at the Primary/Tertial/Tail relationship can make it easy. Here
> are the important points taken from this article "*Morphometric features
> of Pacific and American Golden-Plovers with comments on field
> identification*" (
> https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=9bc92b3f984f118928e8f292158d19a586cc53ea
> ):
> - Pacific has 2-3 primaries visible beyond tertials, American has 4-5
> - tertials extend to distal third of tail, ending at or near tail tip in
> most Pacific, from half to distal third of tail on American
> - wing tip extends past end of tail more on American than Pacific, with
> little or no overlap
> - tips of outer two primaries are closer together on Pacific, with some
> overlap.
>
> With a good look at the rear end of the bird these differences create a
> different overall look, even if you can't see the details clearly. Kent's
> original photo that was posted to IBLE is a good example - it hints at
> Pacific with tertials appearing to extend nearly to end of tail and very
> short primary tips visible. You can't quite see the details but there is
> enough to suggest the need for a closer look. After reviewing the above
> linked article I did a Google search for photos and these features are
> clearly visible in countless examples of both species. If you want to get a
> better handle on Golden Plovers I'd recommend reading the article and
> spending some time looking at photos.
>
> Cliff
>
> --
> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
> Island Park, <Idahocliffandlisa...>
>
>
>
>
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Date: 5/3/25 4:37 pm
From: scott urban via groups.io <scotturban610...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
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Date: 5/3/25 1:44 pm
From: Ken Miracle via groups.io <chukar28...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
Got it … I should have said I was wondering if more photos were needed because I have culled my photos taken 5-1-25 after 6 pm in horrible light with lots of weeds in the way down to 84 with a lot of angles.
I thought the ones from the AM covered what was needed so I processed my photos from a church event after I got home that I needed to get out.
Then I have been birding some more instead of processing the raw images :-)
> On May 3, 2025, at 1:28 PM, Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> wrote:
>
> I'm not asking for anything. I just thought there would be interest in the ID criteria.
>
> Cliff
>
> On 5/3/25 01:20PM, Ken Miracle via groups.io wrote:
>> I have seen that comparison of the primaries and tail on several ebird checklists including RLRowlands and others who saw the bird and many better photos than Kent’s that show what you are asking to see so not sure what you are asking for?
>>
>>> On May 3, 2025, at 1:06 PM, Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> <mailto:<cliffandlisa...> wrote:
>>>
>>> I've looked at more than 20 eBird checklists for the Pacific Golden Plover at Black's Creek. I don't see much mention of the relative length of Primaries/Tertails/Tail that is the only reliable way to separate American and Pacific without calls. It works in any plumage with the only caveat being that it may not work for molting birds.
>>>
>>> Breeding plumage Americans with no white on the flanks are straight forward but during molt they can look like much like Pacifics, and juveniles are very similar. The long bill and long legs can be helpful but a good look at the Primary/Tertial/Tail relationship can make it easy. Here are the important points taken from this article "Morphometric features of Pacific and American Golden-Plovers with comments on field identification" (https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=9bc92b3f984f118928e8f292158d19a586cc53ea):
>>> - Pacific has 2-3 primaries visible beyond tertials, American has 4-5
>>> - tertials extend to distal third of tail, ending at or near tail tip in most Pacific, from half to distal third of tail on American
>>> - wing tip extends past end of tail more on American than Pacific, with little or no overlap
>>> - tips of outer two primaries are closer together on Pacific, with some overlap.
>>>
>>> With a good look at the rear end of the bird these differences create a different overall look, even if you can't see the details clearly. Kent's original photo that was posted to IBLE is a good example - it hints at Pacific with tertials appearing to extend nearly to end of tail and very short primary tips visible. You can't quite see the details but there is enough to suggest the need for a closer look. After reviewing the above linked article I did a Google search for photos and these features are clearly visible in countless examples of both species. If you want to get a better handle on Golden Plovers I'd recommend reading the article and spending some time looking at photos.
>>>
>>> Cliff
>>>
>>> --
>>> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
>>> Island Park, Idaho
>>> <cliffandlisa...> <mailto:<cliffandlisa...>
>>
>> Ken Miracle
>> <chukar28...> <mailto:<chukar28...>
>> 208-570-2780
>> "Not that we are sufficient in ourselves to claim anything as coming from us, but our sufficiency is from God" 2COR 3:5
>>
> --
> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
> Island Park, Idaho
> <cliffandlisa...> <mailto:<cliffandlisa...>
>
Ken Miracle
<chukar28...>
208-570-2780
"Not that we are sufficient in ourselves to claim anything as coming from us, but our sufficiency is from God" 2COR 3:5
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Date: 5/3/25 12:28 pm
From: Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
I'm not asking for anything. I just thought there would be interest in
the ID criteria.
Cliff
On 5/3/25 01:20PM, Ken Miracle via groups.io wrote:
> I have seen that comparison of the primaries and tail on several ebird
> checklists including RLRowlands and others who saw the bird and many
> better photos than Kent’s that show what you are asking to see so not
> sure what you are asking for?
>
>> On May 3, 2025, at 1:06 PM, Cliff Weisse via groups.io
>> <cliffandlisa...> wrote:
>>
>> I've looked at more than 20 eBird checklists for the Pacific Golden
>> Plover at Black's Creek. I don't see much mention of the relative
>> length of Primaries/Tertails/Tail that is the only reliable way to
>> separate American and Pacific without calls. It works in any plumage
>> with the only caveat being that it may not work for molting birds.
>>
>> Breeding plumage Americans with no white on the flanks are straight
>> forward but during molt they can look like much like Pacifics, and
>> juveniles are very similar. The long bill and long legs can be
>> helpful but a good look at the Primary/Tertial/Tail relationship can
>> make it easy. Here are the important points taken from this article
>> "*/Morphometric features of Pacific and American Golden-Plovers with
>> comments on field identification/*"
>> (https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=9bc92b3f984f118928e8f292158d19a586cc53ea):
>> - Pacific has 2-3 primaries visible beyond tertials, American has 4-5
>> - tertials extend to distal third of tail, ending at or near tail tip
>> in most Pacific, from half to distal third of tail on American
>> - wing tip extends past end of tail more on American than Pacific,
>> with little or no overlap
>> - tips of outer two primaries are closer together on Pacific, with
>> some overlap.
>>
>> With a good look at the rear end of the bird these differences create
>> a different overall look, even if you can't see the details clearly.
>> Kent's original photo that was posted to IBLE is a good example - it
>> hints at Pacific with tertials appearing to extend nearly to end of
>> tail and very short primary tips visible. You can't quite see the
>> details but there is enough to suggest the need for a closer look.
>> After reviewing the above linked article I did a Google search for
>> photos and these features are clearly visible in countless examples
>> of both species. If you want to get a better handle on Golden Plovers
>> I'd recommend reading the article and spending some time looking at
>> photos.
>>
>> Cliff
>>
>> --
>> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
>> Island Park, Idaho
>> <cliffandlisa...>
>
> Ken Miracle
> <chukar28...>
> 208-570-2780
> "Not that we are sufficient in ourselves to claim anything as coming
> from us, but our sufficiency is from God" 2COR 3:5
>
>
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 5/3/25 12:20 pm
From: Ken Miracle via groups.io <chukar28...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
I have seen that comparison of the primaries and tail on several ebird checklists including RLRowlands and others who saw the bird and many better photos than Kent’s that show what you are asking to see so not sure what you are asking for?
> On May 3, 2025, at 1:06 PM, Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> wrote:
>
> I've looked at more than 20 eBird checklists for the Pacific Golden Plover at Black's Creek. I don't see much mention of the relative length of Primaries/Tertails/Tail that is the only reliable way to separate American and Pacific without calls. It works in any plumage with the only caveat being that it may not work for molting birds.
>
> Breeding plumage Americans with no white on the flanks are straight forward but during molt they can look like much like Pacifics, and juveniles are very similar. The long bill and long legs can be helpful but a good look at the Primary/Tertial/Tail relationship can make it easy. Here are the important points taken from this article "Morphometric features of Pacific and American Golden-Plovers with comments on field identification" (https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=9bc92b3f984f118928e8f292158d19a586cc53ea):
> - Pacific has 2-3 primaries visible beyond tertials, American has 4-5
> - tertials extend to distal third of tail, ending at or near tail tip in most Pacific, from half to distal third of tail on American
> - wing tip extends past end of tail more on American than Pacific, with little or no overlap
> - tips of outer two primaries are closer together on Pacific, with some overlap.
>
> With a good look at the rear end of the bird these differences create a different overall look, even if you can't see the details clearly. Kent's original photo that was posted to IBLE is a good example - it hints at Pacific with tertials appearing to extend nearly to end of tail and very short primary tips visible. You can't quite see the details but there is enough to suggest the need for a closer look. After reviewing the above linked article I did a Google search for photos and these features are clearly visible in countless examples of both species. If you want to get a better handle on Golden Plovers I'd recommend reading the article and spending some time looking at photos.
>
> Cliff
>
> --
> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
> Island Park, Idaho
> <cliffandlisa...> <mailto:<cliffandlisa...>
>
Ken Miracle
<chukar28...>
208-570-2780
"Not that we are sufficient in ourselves to claim anything as coming from us, but our sufficiency is from God" 2COR 3:5
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Date: 5/3/25 12:07 pm
From: Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...>
Subject: [IBLE] Golden Plover ID |
I've looked at more than 20 eBird checklists for the Pacific Golden
Plover at Black's Creek. I don't see much mention of the relative length
of Primaries/Tertails/Tail that is the only reliable way to separate
American and Pacific without calls. It works in any plumage with the
only caveat being that it may not work for molting birds.
Breeding plumage Americans with no white on the flanks are straight
forward but during molt they can look like much like Pacifics, and
juveniles are very similar. The long bill and long legs can be helpful
but a good look at the Primary/Tertial/Tail relationship can make it
easy. Here are the important points taken from this article
"*/Morphometric features of Pacific and American Golden-Plovers with
comments on field identification/*"
(https://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=9bc92b3f984f118928e8f292158d19a586cc53ea):
- Pacific has 2-3 primaries visible beyond tertials, American has 4-5
- tertials extend to distal third of tail, ending at or near tail tip in
most Pacific, from half to distal third of tail on American
- wing tip extends past end of tail more on American than Pacific, with
little or no overlap
- tips of outer two primaries are closer together on Pacific, with some
overlap.
With a good look at the rear end of the bird these differences create a
different overall look, even if you can't see the details clearly.
Kent's original photo that was posted to IBLE is a good example - it
hints at Pacific with tertials appearing to extend nearly to end of tail
and very short primary tips visible. You can't quite see the details but
there is enough to suggest the need for a closer look. After reviewing
the above linked article I did a Google search for photos and these
features are clearly visible in countless examples of both species. If
you want to get a better handle on Golden Plovers I'd recommend reading
the article and spending some time looking at photos.
Cliff
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 5/3/25 11:14 am
From: Bill Moore via groups.io <hootowlbill...>
Subject: [IBLE] Finally |
First hummer today, black chinned, week later than recent years. Other recent arrivals include Cassins Finches, Sapsucker, Turkey Vultures, Stellar's Jay (doing a Red Tail call) and Mourning Doves. Great Horns and Saw Whets are calling at night up in the trees.
Bill Moore
Hoot owl Rd
Inkom
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Date: 5/3/25 8:41 am
From: Cheryl Huizinga via groups.io <bchuizinga...>
Subject: [IBLE] Black-bellied Plover at Ft Boise WMA near Parma in Canyon Co. |
Not near as fun as a Pacific Golden-plover, but a nice breeding plumaged
Black-bellied Plover in pond right of road driving in. I’m scoping from
road. Also a Semipalmated Plover in same area.
Cheryl
Cheryl Huizinga
<bchuizinga...>
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Date: 5/2/25 5:15 am
From: Richard and Ann Rusnak via groups.io <rarusnak62...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
Thanks team IBLE, great updates, we are heading there today. Spotted this broad wing in Valley Co 0n 4/30!
Cheers Ya’ll
Rich Rusnak

> On May 1, 2025, at 8:33 PM, Jay Carlisle via groups.io <carlislejay...> wrote:
>
> After waiting a while with impatient kiddos, it flew back in calling at ~815pm & landed for good views (just N/NW of creek). The flight call matched that for Pacific (Sibley app) & not American.
>
> Great find!!
>
>
> <https://mail.onelink.me/107872968?pid=nativeplacement&c=Global_Acquisition_YMktg_315_Internal_EmailSignature&af_sub1=Acquisition&af_sub2=Global_YMktg&af_sub3=&af_sub4=100000604&af_sub5=EmailSignature__Static_>
>
> On Thursday, May 1, 2025, 8:14 PM, Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...> wrote:
>
> I posted some photos both in my eBird list and on the Idaho Rare Birds Facebook page under Kent’s initial post.
>
> Louisa Evers
> <elouisa603...> <mailto:<elouisa603...>
> Take care of the birds and you take care of the world
>
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2025 at 16:27 Carter Strope via groups.io <http://groups.io/> <cmstropep...> <mailto:<gmail.com...>> wrote:
> Hey all,
>
> Having seen additional photos shared on Facebook by Sean Pursley, I think the case for Pacific over American is strong. The photos show a remarkably short primary projection, a relatively long bill, and significant white in the flanks and sides of the undertail with a narrow strip of white running down the side of the neck. More photos/angles would be awesome, but based off of Sean's photos I think this bird is quite convincing for Pacific.
>
> Carter
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2025, 07:57 Cliff Weisse via groups.io <http://groups.io/> <cliffandlisa...> <mailto:<octobersetters.com...>> wrote:
> Has anyone evaluated the relationship of tail/tertials/primaries on this bird? I can't tell from the photos but it would be good to eliminate the possibility of a much rarer Pacific Golden Plover. If you're photographing it try to get some that depict the primary extension and projection. Either way it's a very cool bird.
>
> Cliff
>
> On 5/1/25 11:06AM, henderson.danette via groups.io <http://groups.io/> wrote:
>> On north east shore.
>> Danette Henderson
>> Boise
> --
> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
> Island Park, Idaho
> <cliffandlisa...> <mailto:<cliffandlisa...>
>
>
>
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Date: 5/1/25 7:34 pm
From: Jay Carlisle via groups.io <carlislejay...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
After waiting a while with impatient kiddos, it flew back in calling at ~815pm & landed for good views (just N/NW of creek). Â The flight call matched that for Pacific (Sibley app) & not American.
Great find!!
On Thursday, May 1, 2025, 8:14 PM, Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...> wrote:
I posted some photos both in my eBird list and on the Idaho Rare Birds Facebook page under Kent’s initial post.Â
Louisa Evers
<elouisa603...> care of the birds and you take care of the world
On Thu, May 1, 2025 at 16:27 Carter Strope via groups.io <cmstropep...> wrote:
Hey all,
Having seen additional photos shared on Facebook by Sean Pursley, I think the case for Pacific over American is strong. The photos show a remarkably short primary projection, a relatively long bill, and significant white in the flanks and sides of the undertail with a narrow strip of white running down the side of the neck. More photos/angles would be awesome, but based off of Sean's photos I think this bird is quite convincing for Pacific.
Carter
On Thu, May 1, 2025, 07:57 Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...> wrote:
Has anyone evaluated the relationship of tail/tertials/primaries on this bird? I can't tell from the photos but it would be good to eliminate the possibility of a much rarer Pacific Golden Plover. If you're photographing it try to get some that depict the primary extension and projection. Either way it's a very cool bird.
Cliff
On 5/1/25 11:06AM, henderson.danette via groups.io wrote:
On north east shore. Danette Henderson Boise
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 5/1/25 7:14 pm
From: Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
I posted some photos both in my eBird list and on the Idaho Rare Birds
Facebook page under Kent’s initial post.
Louisa Evers
<elouisa603...>
Take care of the birds and you take care of the world
On Thu, May 1, 2025 at 16:27 Carter Strope via groups.io <cmstropep=
<gmail.com...> wrote:
> Hey all,
>
> Having seen additional photos shared on Facebook by Sean Pursley, I think
> the case for Pacific over American is strong. The photos show a remarkably
> short primary projection, a relatively long bill, and significant white in
> the flanks and sides of the undertail with a narrow strip of white running
> down the side of the neck. More photos/angles would be awesome, but based
> off of Sean's photos I think this bird is quite convincing for Pacific.
>
> Carter
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2025, 07:57 Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa=
> <octobersetters.com...> wrote:
>
>> Has anyone evaluated the relationship of tail/tertials/primaries on this
>> bird? I can't tell from the photos but it would be good to eliminate the
>> possibility of a much rarer Pacific Golden Plover. If you're photographing
>> it try to get some that depict the primary extension and projection. Either
>> way it's a very cool bird.
>>
>> Cliff
>> On 5/1/25 11:06AM, henderson.danette via groups.io wrote:
>>
>> On north east shore.
>> Danette Henderson
>> Boise
>>
>> --
>> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
>> Island Park, <Idahocliffandlisa...>
>>
>>
>
>
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Date: 5/1/25 6:58 pm
From: Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
There are a number of excellent photos that show barely the tip of the
third primary extending beyond the tertials, tertials extend more than
2/3 of the way out the tail, and the primaries have short projection
beyond the tail. Legs look long and bill does too. There is only one
previous documented record (July 2003) plus a historic record in Birds
of Idaho.
Cliff
On 5/1/25 07:34PM, Cliff Weisse wrote:
>
> I just looked at Sean's photos on his eBird checklist and I agree it
> looks good for pacific. Awesome bird!
>
> Cliff
>
> On 5/1/25 04:27PM, Carter Strope via groups.io wrote:
>> Hey all,
>>
>> Having seen additional photos shared on Facebook by Sean Pursley, I
>> think the case for Pacific over American is strong. The photos show a
>> remarkably short primary projection, a relatively long bill, and
>> significant white in the flanks and sides of the undertail with a
>> narrow strip of white running down the side of the neck. More
>> photos/angles would be awesome, but based off of Sean's photos I
>> think this bird is quite convincing for Pacific.
>>
>> Carter
>>
>> On Thu, May 1, 2025, 07:57 Cliff Weisse via groups.io
>> <http://groups.io> <cliffandlisa...> wrote:
>>
>> Has anyone evaluated the relationship of tail/tertials/primaries
>> on this bird? I can't tell from the photos but it would be good
>> to eliminate the possibility of a much rarer Pacific Golden
>> Plover. If you're photographing it try to get some that depict
>> the primary extension and projection. Either way it's a very cool
>> bird.
>>
>> Cliff
>>
>> On 5/1/25 11:06AM, henderson.danette via groups.io
>> <http://groups.io> wrote:
>>> On north east shore.
>>> Danette Henderson
>>> Boise
>>
>> --
>> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
>> Island Park, Idaho
>> <cliffandlisa...>
>>
> --
> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
> Island Park, Idaho
> <cliffandlisa...>
>
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 5/1/25 6:35 pm
From: Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
I just looked at Sean's photos on his eBird checklist and I agree it
looks good for pacific. Awesome bird!
Cliff
On 5/1/25 04:27PM, Carter Strope via groups.io wrote:
> Hey all,
>
> Having seen additional photos shared on Facebook by Sean Pursley, I
> think the case for Pacific over American is strong. The photos show a
> remarkably short primary projection, a relatively long bill, and
> significant white in the flanks and sides of the undertail with a
> narrow strip of white running down the side of the neck. More
> photos/angles would be awesome, but based off of Sean's photos I think
> this bird is quite convincing for Pacific.
>
> Carter
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2025, 07:57 Cliff Weisse via groups.io
> <http://groups.io> <cliffandlisa...> wrote:
>
> Has anyone evaluated the relationship of tail/tertials/primaries
> on this bird? I can't tell from the photos but it would be good to
> eliminate the possibility of a much rarer Pacific Golden Plover.
> If you're photographing it try to get some that depict the primary
> extension and projection. Either way it's a very cool bird.
>
> Cliff
>
> On 5/1/25 11:06AM, henderson.danette via groups.io
> <http://groups.io> wrote:
>> On north east shore.
>> Danette Henderson
>> Boise
>
> --
> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
> Island Park, Idaho
> <cliffandlisa...>
>
>
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 5/1/25 6:29 pm
From: Jim via groups.io <jjameshouse...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
I called it as a Pacific on my checklist. I had seen Sean's pictures, they seem to be the best posted. Therefore I was looking for the white striping down the side. In my opinion the stripe continued in a broken line all the way down the side to the undertail coverts. Admittedly I only had a brief look because it left when the Stilts it was with flushed, but still like Sean's photos.
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Date: 5/1/25 3:27 pm
From: Carter Strope via groups.io <cmstropep...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
Hey all,
Having seen additional photos shared on Facebook by Sean Pursley, I think
the case for Pacific over American is strong. The photos show a remarkably
short primary projection, a relatively long bill, and significant white in
the flanks and sides of the undertail with a narrow strip of white running
down the side of the neck. More photos/angles would be awesome, but based
off of Sean's photos I think this bird is quite convincing for Pacific.
Carter
On Thu, May 1, 2025, 07:57 Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa=
<octobersetters.com...> wrote:
> Has anyone evaluated the relationship of tail/tertials/primaries on this
> bird? I can't tell from the photos but it would be good to eliminate the
> possibility of a much rarer Pacific Golden Plover. If you're photographing
> it try to get some that depict the primary extension and projection. Either
> way it's a very cool bird.
>
> Cliff
> On 5/1/25 11:06AM, henderson.danette via groups.io wrote:
>
> On north east shore.
> Danette Henderson
> Boise
>
> --
> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
> Island Park, <Idahocliffandlisa...>
>
>
>
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Date: 5/1/25 2:41 pm
From: rattlesnake4873 via groups.io <Rattlesnake4873...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
We were there Wednesday and did not get to NE shore. Did have a marbled
godwit on south end though,
Dean
Did you hear Mrs. Ainslie passed away earlier this week?
On Thu, May 1, 2025 at 11:06 AM henderson.danette via groups.io <danette444=
<gmail.com...> wrote:
> On north east shore.
> Danette Henderson
> Boise
>
>
>
--
Dean Jones
"A world of facts lies outside and beyond the world of words." Thomas Huxley
208-859-0072
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Date: 5/1/25 2:37 pm
From: Louisa Evers via groups.io <elouisa603...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
We're trying for decent photos of the primary extension. Difficult with
the atmospheric distortion and trying not to keep spooking the bird.
On Thu, May 1, 2025 at 11:57 AM Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa=
<octobersetters.com...> wrote:
> Has anyone evaluated the relationship of tail/tertials/primaries on this
> bird? I can't tell from the photos but it would be good to eliminate the
> possibility of a much rarer Pacific Golden Plover. If you're photographing
> it try to get some that depict the primary extension and projection. Either
> way it's a very cool bird.
>
> Cliff
> On 5/1/25 11:06AM, henderson.danette via groups.io wrote:
>
> On north east shore.
> Danette Henderson
> Boise
>
> --
> Cliff and Lisa Weisse
> Island Park, <Idahocliffandlisa...>
>
>
>
>
--
Louisa Evers
<elouisa603...>
Take care of the birds and you take care of the world
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Date: 5/1/25 10:57 am
From: Cliff Weisse via groups.io <cliffandlisa...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden Plover continuing at Blacks Creek |
Has anyone evaluated the relationship of tail/tertials/primaries on this
bird? I can't tell from the photos but it would be good to eliminate the
possibility of a much rarer Pacific Golden Plover. If you're
photographing it try to get some that depict the primary extension and
projection. Either way it's a very cool bird.
Cliff
On 5/1/25 11:06AM, henderson.danette via groups.io wrote:
> On north east shore.
> Danette Henderson
> Boise
>
--
Cliff and Lisa Weisse
Island Park, Idaho
<cliffandlisa...>
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Date: 4/30/25 9:40 pm
From: Kent Kleman via groups.io <Kentkleman...>
Subject: Re: [IBLE] American Golden-Plover at Blacks Creek Reservoir |
Blacks Creek Reservoir is in Ada County east of Boise
On Apr 30, 2025, at 10:38 PM, Kent Kleman via groups.io <Kentkleman...> wrote:
 Breeding plumage bird found this evening by Brad Hammond, last seen in the weeds on the east side mudflat.
<image0.jpeg>
<image1.jpeg>
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Date: 4/22/25 7:17 pm
From: Jay Carlisle via groups.io <carlislejay...>
Subject: [IBLE] Male Harlequin Duck, hwy 21 b/t Boise & Idaho City |
Kim Liebich just texted me a pic of a male Harlequin Duck @ ~mile 28.5 of highway 21 en route to Idaho City.  She said there’s a tiny pullout there but to be careful.
Maybe too late to look tonight 🤔 but maybe it’ll linger overnight?
Jay
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Date: 4/13/25 12:27 pm
From: lcarrigan_55 via groups.io <carriganbw...>
Subject: [IBLE] Some More Spring Arrivals |
A few more Spring arrivals this weekend: Killdeer, White Pelican, DC Cormorant &, just now, a pr of male & female Cassin's Finches to the feeder. Plus, the House Finches are in full breeding plumage now: bright reds, oranges & yellows. Male RW Blackbirds have been present for several wks, no females yet.
Brian Carrigan
Blackfoot
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